E211: 사라 브루스크(Sara Brueske) - "디스크 독 라이프"

Because you have all the Cooleys, and then the Belgians, and then the others. I started by age, but then I realized that I left Taboo out, who is just younger than Zuma. And then I started going by order of how I acquired them. And that just was a disaster. It's all good. I think we got them all in there, though. I think so, too. So, I wanted to talk about DISC today. So, to kind of start us out, just how did you originally even get into DISC? Yeah. So, DISC is one of those things. I had a Border Collie when I was younger. And, you know, I watched the Incredible Dog Challenge on TV. And that's really how I started, you know, my love for dog sports as a whole. And so, I convinced my parents to let me buy this Border Collie. I saved up all my money to buy him from the newspaper, of course, from, you know, not-so-great breeders. But I didn't know back then. I was 11 years old. And I wanted him to be a DISC dog. And, well, he just, he never jumped like the DISC dogs I saw on TV. And that really demotivated me. Like, he wouldn't really catch the Frisbee. He chased it. But it just wasn't the way, you know, the dogs on TV were. And, of course, me being 11 years old, I didn't realize that there was, like, training that actually went into that. And it just wasn't just sheer luck that the dogs look that way. And so, I switched gears and went to agility. And, you know, a lot of my love is agility. And that was a lot of my foundation as a trainer. But then I got Zuma, who was a Border Collie mix that I adopted. And while she was training for agility and I was working at agility facility, there was this whole, like, summer where I'd rather be playing outside. And, of course, in Minnesota, most of the agility training is indoors because, like, what do you do in the wintertime when there's two feet of snow on the ground, right? And so, during the summertime, I'm like, I just want to be outside with my dogs. You know, I want to go hiking. I want to swim with them. I want to do sports that I can do outside. And so, at one point, I found somebody on Craigslist that was selling, like, a box of used dog Frisbees. I was like, oh, why don't I try Frisbee with her again? And so, I went and I bought these Frisbees. And I started throwing for Zuma. And she was just amazing. Naturally, she left for the Frisbee. She caught him. She brought him back. I started watching YouTube videos and, like, trying to replicate the tricks I saw on there. I posted on Facebook a picture of her with a Frisbee. And somebody from the Minnesota Disc Dog Club contacted me. I was like, hey, that's one of our discs.

You should come join us at this competition. I was like, okay. Like, so I just went to this competition and entered Zuma in novice, toss and catch in novice freestyle, even though we had no idea what we're doing. And we got first place in both. And so, from there, I was absolutely hooked, right? Because here's a sport that, like, we went, didn't know what we were doing. Like, I didn't even have music for my freestyle round. So, they made me play to Save a Horse, Ride a Cowboy. It was, like, the worst freestyle song ever. And so, from there, I got completely hooked. I fell in love with disc. I fell in love with the Minnesota Disc Dog Club. I got a whole bunch of friends that we kind of grew up in the sport together. I had some really great mentors. Paul Winsworth was one of them. Just amazing, amazing people. Great community. So welcoming to me. And so, then, from there, in the wintertime, when you couldn't play disc outside, I did agility. And in the summertime, I did Disc Dog. And so, anybody that knows me knows that I have, like, 5,000 interests. And so, that really helped me stay in the game because I was able to jump back and forth between the two sports and not really get bored, as I tend to do. And so, yeah, from there, I started competing at qualifiers and eventually going to, like, the Up Dog World International Finals and competing there. And I was able to win that the first year that they held it. And I was really, really cool. And the second year as well, I won freestyle. And so, it kind of just, like, blossomed into this thing. And at some point, Perina was like, hey, we're looking for another dog trainer. And I interviewed for that job, auditioned for it. And, you know, we got it. And so, it just kind of blossomed from this kind of, like, spur-of-the-moment hobby that we did just for funsies into an actual career. And that's been really, really cool. Okay. So, I want to kind of wind it back a little bit there. So, you were talking about some of the different games that you were playing when you first kind of went to that first trial. You had no idea what they were. And I think that the no idea what they were thing is probably common for folks when they first look at discs. So, can you just talk us through some of the different games there and what they are? I mean, there's just a whole bunch of things there, right? Yeah. And that's really the cool thing about Disc Dog is that you can totally show up to a competition, have no idea what you're doing.

And if your dog likes to chase the Frisbee like they do in the backyard, and it's a dog that doesn't mind a bunch of distractions, like people cheering for them in loud music, you can really have a lot of success your first time out. And generally, the communities are so nice and welcoming to newbies. So, 100%, if you don't know what you're doing but your dog loves Frisbee, go to a competition and have fun. So, the general format, the traditional format for Disc Dog competitions is Toss and Catch or Toss and Fetch. It always has a bunch of different names as well as a freestyle component. And so, you can generally compete in those two things separately. So, you could enter just the Toss and Catch, which is your traditional game of fetch. You throw one Frisbee down the field, the dog catches it, brings it back for another. And then you get points for how far those catches are, those throws are. And, you know, some of the venues, you get more points for the more throws. Other ones just take, you know, your best five catches out of that. And then you have freestyle. And freestyle is what people think of when they think of Disc Dog. So, it's choreographed routines to music involving a whole bunch of different really cool tricks. And so, generally, when you go to a competition, there's different levels. So, like novice, open, and pro, or, you know, depending on the organization, what those are called. But generally, there's different levels that you can compete at. So, the newbies aren't really competing with the top-level players, which is really nice. So, that's generally the layout. So, you have toss and catch. You have freestyle. You can compete in separate. You can compete in them together, depending on the organization. But then you have different games and strategy games. So, then you have Skyhound's Disc Dog-a-thon. It's comprised of a bunch of different strategy games. So, meaning one game, you might have to get two catches across the line as quickly as you can. Or another one, spot landing, you might have to get catches in certain circles in a certain order. And so, they're more about, you know, kind of like the flat work components that have to do with freestyle. So, moving your dog around the field and kind of using your strategy and your teamwork to get points in those games. So, it's kind of like this hybrid version of toss and catch versus freestyle, that happy medium. And then you have Up Dog. So, the Up Dog Challenge is a whole other organization. And yes, what is Up Dog? I will tell you what's Up Dog. It is an organization that's really cool.

It was developed by some friends of mine. So, Kat and Jack Folle, Jason and Andrea Riggler, they are the masterminds behind Up Dog Challenge. And so, what it is, is it has a freestyle component. It has the toss and fetch game. But it also has a whole bunch of different strategy games. And they're constantly coming up with new games, which is really exciting. And they even have agility hybrid games. So, you might have to do jump, tunnel, jump to get a frisbee catch. And so, that one, again, their whole idea behind the Up Dog Challenge was to find a fun way for people to really work those flat work skills for freestyle. So, that new players aren't just going into freestyle like I did with no clue of what they're doing. But at least they can move their dogs around the field. At least they can time their throws that their dog is safe. And so, that's kind of the idea behind Up Dog Challenge. So, you have toss and catch. You have freestyle. You have your strategy games. There's one more aspect of Disc Dog that's really cool. And it's definitely not one I excel at. It's the long distance throws. And so, you have the Quadruped, which is a tournament style organization where you go to a competition. You do a seeding throw to figure out which division you're in. And then it's a tournament style from there. Sky Owens also has a long distance component of their competitions as well. And those are really cool. And so, for that, you typically get X number of throws. And the longest throw with a catch is going to be the winner in those competitions in a nutshell. So, lots of different competitions. Lots of ways to have fun with your dog. And the cool part is that variety allows a whole bunch of different teams to be successful. So, you don't have to be awesome at freestyle. You don't even have to be awesome at toss and catch. You can excel at one of the other games for sure. So, which of those do you do with your guys? Can you share a little more kind of about which bits and pieces you've competed in? Yeah. So, I've competed in all of them. I try not to do Quadruped because, man, those women with those beast arms, like, they just make me feel like I got spaghetti arms. And I'm just not good at that. So, I'm definitely one of those people that if I compete in something, I want to be at the top of it because I have that part in my brain. And I'd rather not. So, I just tend to avoid the long-distance stuff for that reason alone. But I really, really enjoy Up Dog. And I really love the mission behind it. I love that everybody can have a success for it. And so, I tend to give them most of my money.

And I really, really like to be part of that because the community around it is just so great. And I feel like that's such a needed thing, especially in a sport where it's such a community-based sport. So, while I've done all of the different venues, so Skyhounds, USDDN, AWI, UFO, all of those, Up Dog Challenge is absolutely my favorite. Sounds good. All right. So, some of the skills here are obvious, right? So, dog has to learn to catch a frisbee. Dog has to ideally learn to bring it back. What are some of the other foundation skills that we're looking at for a team interested in really getting started? So, the teams that really have a great foundation moving into Disc Dog are agility teams. Because a lot of the times, Disc is about, you know, communicating with your dog, making sure they're moving around the field okay, and timing your throws so that your dog can safely catch it. So, that is a huge thing, just being able to read your dog and direct your dog where you want them to go. And then, of course, the most important skill, which is like 90% of the game, is that throw. Making sure that the handler can throw accurately so that they can put the disc where the dog needs it in order to make that safe catch. And so, I think people underestimate the value of just grabbing frisbees and going out and practicing without your dog. And so, I always recommend that you have to, you know, be at least a proficient thrower, meaning I should be able to throw a backhand where I want it to be to make sure that you're safe for your dog. Now, of course, there's a whole bunch of different factors. Wind comes into play, different disc types and all that. But definitely getting out there and practicing throwing before you get serious about the Disc Dog competition is a good idea. So, any tips for learning to throw? Yeah, grab those frisbees and go throw. Making sure that you have somebody to coach you is a huge thing, whether that's an online class like the Disc Dog Handler's Choice, the Foundations class that will be coming up. That's a good one. And sending me video. Otherwise, going and finding your local Disc Dog club and getting tips from them in person is a huge thing. Because while practice makes perfect, it makes permanent, too. So, if you're practicing bad throwing technique, then you're going to be really good at bad throwing technique. But if you're practicing good habits, then, of course, that's what you're going to be more proficient at. And so, making sure that you're learning from somebody about how to properly throw.

Other than that, like just grabbing those discs and going and whipping them out of the fence and paying attention to what your arm is doing and tweaking little minor things to see how it impacts the throw of that disc is a huge thing. So, we kind of talked about, you know, some of the different games and things. I know you mentioned that freestyle is the thing most people think of when they kind of see the YouTube videos and whatnot. I certainly think it's probably the flashiest piece. So, can you kind of talk us through some of the basic tricks that are involved and some of the basic tricks people may see if they're watching some of those videos? Yeah, absolutely. So, freestyle is my absolute favorite thing. There's so much room for creativity. I mean, just the different types of throws that you can throw to your dogs. And that's so encouraged. And the fact that you can put really cool music to it and make it your own. Like, that is my absolute favorite part about freestyle. So, not only is it flashy, but it really shows the handler and the dog and how they want to portray their team, which is really cool to me. So, the basic different tricks that are generally included, you have your vaults, which is where the dog jumps off of the handler to catch a Frisbee. So, you could have like a leg vault where the dog jumps off the leg to catch the Frisbee or a back vault where the dog jumps off the back to catch the Frisbee. So, vaults are dog jumps off of the handler to catch the Frisbee. Then you have overs where the dog jumps over the handler to catch a Frisbee. So, you could have a leg over, an arm over, a body over, and that sort of thing. So, vaults dog jumps off handler to catch a Frisbee. Over, dog jumps over the handler to catch the Frisbee without touching them. Then you have dog catches where the dog catches the Frisbee and then the handler catches the dog. So, I could have just a normal dog catch where I throw the disc and then I catch the dog right after they catch it. I could have a flip catch where my dog does a flip in the air and then I catch my dog. If you want to see some really cool dog catches, definitely check out Tracy Custer. She is the queen of dog catches. Man, she's got some creative moves that, you know, she sets the standard for dog catches for sure. And then you have flips. So, flips are just where the dog turns in there while they catch the Frisbee. So, you can have like forward motion flips. You can have flips that move backwards, all sorts of like a through and flip and all sorts of different tricks with that as well.

And then from there, you have your flat work. So, I could have a zigzag where my dog travels in front of me, catches a Frisbee and then travels to the other side in front of me. So, like 2 o'clock to 10 o'clock and catches a Frisbee there back and forth. And around the world where they catch the Frisbees in a circle pattern around me. A pendulum where they go around me one direction to catch a Frisbee and then go around me the other direction to catch a Frisbee. And all sorts of different like flat work components that way. There's a whole bunch of other categories of tricks, but I'll just leave it there. So, what's actually involved in teaching some of those things? Can you talk us through maybe one of them? Yeah. So, there's generally two different schools of thought when it comes to teaching different disc tricks. So, you'll see a lot of players that use a disc essentially as a lure. And so, they teach their dogs to be comfortable like jumping off their body. And then they just put the disc in the right spot. And they're proficient and good skilled throwers that they can do that. Where the dog just learns to jump off of their body to catch that disc. Then there's like the more dog trainer approach. And that's more what I specialize in where I tend to teach the tricks with food first the best I can. And then introduce the disc after that. And part of that is just because like I come from that dog training background. And that way makes more sense to me than putting that disc where it needs to be in order for the dog to catch it. And the other part of that is when I entered the sport, I wasn't a skilled thrower. So, I just couldn't put that disc reliably where it needed to be. And so, it was easier for me to teach the skill first and then add the disc second. So, we're talking about a lot of like very physical things, right? Like catching the dog and the dog jumping off your body and all these different things. I'd imagine there's quite a bit of work that goes into building the dog's comfort with a lot of those things. Kind of getting that confident look and the ability to like actually physically do them. And then there's also this whole safety component, right? So, can you talk a little bit about how you build the dog's comfort but also how you kind of make sure that where you can, you're taking the safety precautions that are possible to take? Absolutely. So, part of this, if anybody ever meets my dogs, they like jump all over you because I use my disc dog stuff as an excuse to not teach my dogs manners.

And the honesty is I want my dogs to be comfortable jumping all over me so I can effectively teach them not to jump on me and teach them to jump on me at the same time. And especially when they're young dogs, they just don't understand that context. Later on, when they're older, they absolutely can't. And once they have the skills for this dog and they know they can jump on me and they enjoy it in that sport, then I can go ahead and start teaching them, okay, now, but I don't want you to jump on me in this situation. And so, part of that is kind of letting them just be rude a little bit and letting them build that confidence that, oh, it's fun to trample all over my mom. And if you watch what I do with, like, the puppies, a lot of it's, like, this really physical, like, I push them back, they leap at me type of play because I want them realizing that my arms all over them is fun. And I want them pushing through that and really enjoying it. And I want them learning to launch at me because that's my dog catch right there. That's my vault. And so, as puppies, I really kind of encourage that rough and tumble play. But like you said, it has to be done in a safe way. And so, that means that I'm making sure that my dogs aren't landing on the ground, especially my puppies. So, I'll do, like, little mini dog catches and then, like, slowly lower them on the ground. So, a lot of the stuff I'm teaching them, like, jump off the couch so I can catch you. That kind of thing is teaching them how to use their body. But I'm really limiting those reps so they're not doing a whole bunch of them in a row. And I need to make sure I'm confident and capable of making sure they're not landing on the ground and getting injured. So, I have to be very confident in my dog catching ability in order to make sure that I keep my puppy safe. So, that's definitely something to keep in mind. And I also don't want them jumping extreme jumps because that strain of their muscles pushing off of that. The surface will put that strain on their bones that I don't want that there. So, it's kind of like this happy medium of where I want my dogs to have a lot of confidence in their jumping ability. A lot of confidence in flying at me from all sorts of different ways. But not doing so much that I'm going to be hurting my puppy and their growth plates and everything that's, you know, could potentially go wrong with that. So, I try to tell people just don't do it if you're not confident that you'll do it safely. Because we can always teach that stuff later on for sure when those growth plates have closed.

But my adult dogs, if I get like, so Kickstart came to me at four years old. And so, for her, she didn't know me. She had some foundations in disc. But one of the things her owner had said was that she didn't like to vault because she didn't want to touch the hammer. So, for her, I just spent a lot of time working on climbing to my lap for cookies. Jump onto my lap when I'm sitting on an agility table for cookies. That sort of thing. And like I taught her like the rebound where they jump onto you and then push off. I did all of that stuff for treats before I ever even introduced the disc. Because the second I introduced the disc, arousal goes up and she's going to be a little bit more reckless. And I have to be, and she's going to be more likely just to fly around and not like actually hit my body. And the second thing, or the third, I think this is the third thing. The third thing is that my dog, my body has to be safe as well. So, I always joke that because I've done this, you know, as a profession for the past six years, I don't have any nerves left in my leg vaulting leg. Like, there's nothing there. And so, that's just from years of teaching dogs how to vault. Like, once they know how to vault, they're fine and they jump nicely. However, if the wind takes the disc or they're just learning and they don't quite have that mechanics of front paws, back paws, push off yet, I'm definitely going to do some damage to myself. And so, making sure you have protective layers like a vaulting vest, meoprene wraps underneath your pants, that sort of thing will definitely help protect you as a handler. I also encourage handlers to be doing some sort of stretching before they train and making sure that you're physically able to get up and down and do all of those things that are going to be in your tricks. Because as soon as you have that disc and that dog in front of you, you're not going to be moving in slow motion. And so, you need to make sure you're nice and limber before you go out there because it is a workout for the handler as well as the dog. And so, I think a lot of people skip that. I know I do all the time. And I'm like, oh, I should have stretched before I did this. So, it's definitely something to think about is the handler side of the safety as well. Absolutely. So, you mentioned earlier your Handler's Choice class and it's back on the schedule. Can you talk about what kind of things are appropriate for the class, what previous students have worked on, kind of what's covered? Yeah. So, the Handler's Choice title is a little bit of a kind of misleading. A little misleading.

Because, yeah. So, what happened was we did the foundation class and because disc dog is not that common of a sport, we are kind of having a hard time filling it. And so, I wanted to create a class where people of all levels could benefit. And so, then that way I could just have the one disc dog class. Advanced players could come in there and work on what they wanted. And new players can come in and have a curriculum to follow. So, while it is a Handler's Choice class, there is a foundation curriculum to follow. So, any skill level can join. If you've never thrown a Frisbee before, you absolutely can join because I'll tell you how to throw Frisbees. All of that is included in that curriculum. And then, the more advanced players are the people who have taken it before in the past can take it again and work on the new things that they're currently working on. So, I've had everything from people teaching their dogs to vault, people wanting to work on advanced tricks like foot stalls, and even people wanting to build disc dog freestyle routines and really fine-tuning those. So, it's all sorts of different things. But don't be afraid to join. If you've never thrown a disc, if your dog likes to play fetch, they will definitely benefit. Some toy drive would be nice just because while we can teach it for food, it's generally not the easiest path. But, you know, if that's what you guys want to do, I can work on that too for you. So, it's all sorts of different things. Which also means it's really good for those bronze students as well because we get students from all different skill levels and lots and lots of information in that class. Awesome. So, I know you mentioned that there are lectures and I know there's a syllabus. Do you want to just elaborate any more on kind of what's included in the lectures? Like what people can actually expect from reading those? Yeah. So, the lectures in all my classes are generally a written description. So, it'll have your homework and kind of like a written, this is how step by step I want you to do this. And then they'll be followed by like a short example video on the steps that take to get to that. So, for instance, the throwing one, we talk about a backhand. And so, you get kind of like the rundown, written rundown. So, that way if you're better about reading and learning that way, you'll have that. And then you'll have a demo video of me showing the actual steps of that throw itself. We also talk about the flat work components that I kind of mentioned a little bit earlier.

So, being able to move your dog around on the field, making sure that they're dropping when you cue that drop, making sure that they have a bring to hand, which is super important as well. And then we have a bunch of tricks in there too. So, like the dog catches in there, the rebound is in there. I can't quite remember all the tricks we have in there, but a lot of the basic ones, as well as like vault foundations and over foundations as well. Anything else folks should know? I don't know. I don't know if there's anything else we should know. Okay. All right. So, last question here for you, Sarah. So, and this is just kind of the general one I've been ending with for everybody, which is, is there something that you've learned recently or maybe been reminded of recently when it comes to dog training? Um, yeah, I was just in a clubhouse chat with Claudio Piccoli. He's a dog photographer, a friend of mine over in Italy. And he said this thing, and it's just going to stick in my brain for a while. I hope it was. And there's so many parallels between photography and dog training. It's crazy. So, if you're like, wow, why is she talking about photography? Trust me, I'll tie it back. So, his quote was something along the lines of, when you look at a photo, look to see what you like about that photo, not look to see why it got so many likes. And so, what he's talking about is when you see somebody's photo on Facebook, look at it from your perspective and, and look at it from your critical eye. And why do you enjoy that photo? Don't look at it from the perspective of, why did that photo get more likes than this other one? Or how can I replicate it so I get just as many likes as that? I think this ties into Disc Dog in particular, because a lot of times you'll be seeing these crazy players coming up with all these different moves. And we're always comparing that to ourselves. And like, why can't I do those moves? Or why can't I, or why doesn't my content get as many likes and shares as that content? And I think that we kind of need to take a step back and just remember who we are as dog trainers. And really get joy out of, out of our dogs and our journey and not so comparing to other people's, but still learn to look at other people's training and their journey and, and see what we enjoy from that as well. So, less comparing, more about just finding the joy in everybody's journeys. Awesome. Well, that's a good note to end on. Thank you so much for coming on the podcast. Thank you so much for having me, Melissa. And thanks to our listeners for tuning in. We'll be back next week. Don't miss it.

If you haven't already, subscribe to our podcast in iTunes or the podcast app of your choice to have our next episode automatically downloaded to your phone as soon as it becomes available. Today's show is brought to you by the Fenzie Dog Sports Academy. Special thanks to Denise Fenzie for supporting this podcast. Music provided royalty-free by bensound.com. The track featured here is called Buddy. Audio editing provided by Chris Lang. Thanks again for tuning in and happy training. Music Be with cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop cop